GoNOLA Radio Presents: Mardi Gras in New Orleans

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Putting a voice to a face makes it real and relatable, brings life and meaning to it. Especially if that face is one you’ve never seen or met before, but admire nonetheless. Now all those New Orleans characters you’ve always wondered about, been enamored with, or maybe never even heard of come to life through GoNOLA Radio, the new podcast component of GoNOLA.

Three local figures and experts on New Orleans are the hosts of GoNOLA Radio. Lorin Gaudin, the New Orleans Food Goddess and culinary connoisseur, is the guide to New Orleans latest and greatest dining adventures, interviewing all the best chefs and food vendors in the city. Musician’s Village resident and producer of WWOZ’s New Orleans All The Way Live program, George Ingmire, takes listeners through a musical journey of New Orleans, one episode at a time. Mikko of Mikko Presents is an actor, playwright and director of Louisiana Living History Project who is the cultural authority for GoNOLA Radio, talking to the people who make New Orleans so special and distinct. For the official voice of GoNOLA Radio, we our proud to present New Orleans renaissance man, Bruce “Sunpie” Barnes.

We’re kicking off GoNOLA Radio with an episode on Mardi Gras, featuring special guest host Ed Branley who talks with Mr. Mardi Gras himself, Arthur Hardy. Lorin Gaudin talks to Steve Himelfarb, owner of Cake Café, better known as the Cake Man, about his famous and unique king cakes. George Ingmire speaks to New Orleans music legend Al Johnson who wrote “Carnival Time” back in 1960. Finally, Mikko talks with Ausettua Amore Amenkum, dance instructor and Tulane University professor, who opens a window into the world of Mardi Gras Indians.

Welcome to the first episode of GoNOLA Radio!

GoNOLA Radio features music by Cale Pellick.

Podcast Transcript 

Sunpie: Welcome to GoNOLA radio. My name is Sunpie Barnes and I will be your host of hosts as we explore New Orleans to learn about the cities rich cultural heritage, food, and music. We bring you experts, the real deal experts who will talk with you about the people who make New Orleans such a wonderful place to live and visit. It’s GoNOLA radio. Every year between 12th night on January 6th and Mardi Gras day you’ll find New Orleanians eating king cake, that delicious and colorful pastry hiding a plastic baby inside. New Orleans food goddess Lorin Gaudin interviews Steve Himelfarb, the cake man, who has a modern take on that old New Orleans tradition. 

Lorin: Alright, it’s carnival time in New Orleans and that means many, many things but food wise it means something round, something sweet . . . 

Steve: King cake. 

Lorin: King cake. So joining me in the studio is Steve Himelfarb. He is formerly known as the cake man but really still is the cake man in New Orleans at his incredible cafe, which is back in the Marigny at 2440 Charter Street. Love it there. The place is called Cake Cafe and Bakery. Steve is with me in studio. Hey Steve. How are you doing?

Steve: I’m great. 

Lorin: I’m so glad. It’s busy time isn’t it?

Steve: It is. Getting up at 1 AM, getting to the cafe, and cranking out the king cakes. People enjoy them, so it’s a lot of fun to do. 

Lorin: Alright, so we’re talking king cake and maybe people listening have no clue what is a king cake. Tell us what your king cake is. 

Steve: Okay. My king cake goes back top ancient France. 

Lorin: That’s awesome. 

Steve: Well, the king cake does actually go back . . .

Lorin: You make them fresh though right?

Steve: No, well, we take a little bit of dough from that very first king cake 250 years ago. It has been 14 hours I’ve been awake, so I’m a little punchy. In any case, our king cake is an apple goat cheese king cake. The goal with doing apple goat cheese king cake was because we wanted it to be a fresh fruit filling with goat cheese, and that tanginess of the goat cheese, and you have the sweetness of the fresh apples, and we wanted something new. 

Lorin: Because the tradition is cinnamon. Many people do brioche, but more often than not there is the cinnamon roll type dough, that yeast dough, with that sugar and that tender kind of soft sponginess to it. It has texture but it’s not dry. It’s not like old school MacKenzie’s king cake if you remember those. They were dry as dust and beloved by everybody. What’s become more vogue I think in food and in king cakes is something a little bit softer, a little more decadent, and I think yours really covers all of those bases. You do a cinnamon roll dough, right?

Steve: I do a cinnamon roll dough, and thank you very much. It’s an evolution. The king cake really did start in France a few hundred years ago, and there is no documentation what that dough was, but there has been an evolution. It certainly has gone through the evolution. Certainly they weren’t making sweet dough or brioche then. It’s gone through a brioche phase as you’ve just spoke of, which is a little bit drier dough, and into a coffee cake kind of a mode. You’re finding more often a sweet dough, kind of what we do now, and some of that brioche style but since brioche tends to be a little bit drier, as you spoke of, I wanted it to be more of a moist cake. 

Lorin: Inside our king cakes typically, if they are a little baby here, or a [feve] a bean, or a favor which could be something ceramic. I little tiny ceramic piece. That was always something fun. People would get that bean in the king cake and it meant different things in different traditions. What does it mean here when you get the baby in the piece of king cake?

Steve: You get to buy the next king cake at the office. 

Lorin: Alright. Well, I’m holding a slice in my hand that you gratefully brought in the studio. It’s so gorgeous. The dough itself is just incredible, golden, beautiful on the top. The you’ve taken bold, bold colors of yellow and purple and green Mardi Gras colors and then just slashed them, beautifully lashed it across the top of this king cake. Then you slice it and the dough, again it’s beautiful color and texture on the inside, woven in. This particular piece is the apples and goat cheese. Then you see the little shade of cinnamon sort of swirling through there, and it is a piece of art. 

Steve: Well thank you. 

Lorin: And it’s edible art, even more so. 

Steve: It’s fun. It should be. In New Orleans we want to experience so many aspects of our life, and life in New Orleans just seems so vibrant to us at so many times. I wanted the king cake to be a part of that life. 

Lorin: Well I’ve got to tell you, your king cake is visually one of my very favorites to look at. As far as a thing to eat, it’s hands down one of my favorites. I love it so much, and I want to thank you so much for taking the time to some in and talk to us about king cakes. Cake Cafe and Bakery, 2440 Charter Street. Steve Himelfarb, he’s the head chef what in charge, at this incredible place where you can get beautiful food and masterful king cakes. Happy carnival.

Steve: Thank you. You too. Have a great time. 

Sunpie: It’s carnival time in New Orleans you all. That’s also the title of one of the most beloved songs in our city. George Ingmire interviews the man himself, Al “Carnival Time” Johnson who wrote and recorded the song in 1960, over half a century ago. 

George: I’m here with Louisiana Hall of Music inductee, and a neighbor of mine in the musicians village, a gentlemen by the name of Al “Carnival Time” Johnson. I want to welcome you to GoNOLA radio. 

Al: Thank you George, and NOLA radio. 

George: It’s a beautiful place to be. I’m really happy to have you here with us. I want to just start off by talking about when you were younger. The first instrument that I believe was handed to you was a trumpet. 

Al: That’s correct. 

George: Talk about that.

Al: Well, my father bought me a trumpet. He figured I should be like Satchmo. I played the trumpet a little bit but I soon switched over to the piano. 

George: Why did you pick up the piano?

Al: Well, daddy wanted me to sound like Satchmo, and I wanted to sound like Fats Domino and Smiley Lewis, and those people. 

George: We’re talking about carnival time here because your middle name is Al “Carnival Time”. 

Al: Well, that’s my middle name now?

George: Now, carnival time is your middle name. Carnival time, Al “Carnival Time” Johnson. 

Al: Okay. That’s a great one. 

George: It’s a great one. How did you get that name?

Al: Well it must be because I recorded Carnival Time back in 60. 

George: What was that, 52 years ago?

Al: Something like that. 

George: That’s amazing. 

Al: I’ve appreciated it. 

George: Now talk about how you put that song together. There’s a few lyrics immediately I want to bring up here. A couple of lyrics. Alright, here we go. You bring a nickel and I’ll bring a dime. I’ll get together now and we can drink some wine. 

Al: Well it sounds like it, but it was you put a nickel, I’ll put a dime, we’ll get together and drink us some wine. 

George: Okay. 

Al: All because it’s carnival time. 

George: How did you get that much wine for 15 cents, by the way.

Al: Well back then you could do a whole lot with 15 cents. Maybe another nickel more or something, but 15 cents was a good start. 

George: Your song captures the joy of carnival. When you listen to it, even if you’re not from New Orleans, even if you’ve never visited New Orleans, you hear the song and you immediately understand that joy and revelry. Now, how did you do that? How did you capture that so perfectly and put it in a song?

Al: What is see as it was, Art Neville and Professor Longhair were out there talking about Mardi Gras. They were talking about Mardi Gras mambo, which I love. Professor Longhair was talking about going to the Mardi Gras, which I loved. We came up saying carnival. This is carnival this and carnival that, and carnival the other. So I said to myself, there must be some kind of way I can get carnival out there. Then bam. Carnival time. So that’s it. I just worked it out. Back then we used to go to little clubs right there off of Claiborne Street, the Green Room and the Plaza. 

George: Both of which, pardon me for interrupting, both of which are mentioned in your song, correct?

Al: Exactly. 

George: What’s that line?

Al: The Green Room is smoking and the Plaza is burning down. Throw my baby out the window and let these joints burn down. All because it’s carnival time. The next verse was Claiborne. I guess carnival was all over the city, but the one we knew about most, or I knew about, was on Claiborne Street. The friend I recorded for wanted me to take Claiborne Street out, and put Bourbon Street in there. I told him, I said I didn’t know anything about Bourbon Street. Claiborne Street was the street that I enjoyed. I put that lick on them and Claiborne Street is rocking from one side to the other. Which is true. The joints are jamming packed and I’m about to smother. All because it’s carnival time. That was just as true as can be, because that’s where we had our fun. Right there on Claiborne Street. 

George: Let’s just talk a little bit about the studio session. It’s been a while, only 52 years. 

Al: Yeah. 

George: I’m sure there’s some details that are a little hazy, but let’s talk about the horn session because that’s the first thing you kind of hear. 

You had James Rivers?

Al: I always said it was three horns, I thought. Of course, James Rivers that was on the session, he said it was only two. So I accepted that but I always thought it was three. I thought it was Robert Parker, Lee Allen, and James Rivers. Well I thought it was three anyways. 

George: That’s a serious horn session. Even with two of those three that’s a serious horn session. 

Al: Well yes, and I appreciate Joe Ruffino for hooking that up, because all I was able to tell him was how I wanted it to go. I wanted some horns to say da, da, da, da, da, da. I appreciated him for setting it up like that, and getting it done. It really tuned out. I’m just so happy. People do love carnival time. They love that recording. 

George: Now you had a little bit of a tug of war with he phrasing of that song in the studio. They wanted you to do it one way, and you wanted to do it another way. 

Al: When I said, it’s carnival time and everybody’s having fun. Right now it’s carnival time. They said, the Weak Boys, [Shook Van], and [Bukowski] and all those boys, they said they don’t want to write music like that. I said, I don’t know. They said it didn’t go there. I said, it did go there, you know. I wrote it. I put it there. They says, no your timing is off. All they had to do is just feel it. That’s the kind of song carnival time is. You must feel it. All I said was, it’s carnival time and everybody’s having fun. Right now it’s carnival . . . And I thought it was fantastic. But it took them a lot. I think Placide was the one the one that took up for me. He said, well if that’s the way you want it let’s give it to them like that. 

George: Who’s Placide?

Al: That’s Placide Adams, the bass player. 

George: He had a brother right?

Al: Yeah, Justin Adams. 

George: Okay. 

Al: Placide said, you know if that’s the way he wants it, it’s all wrong, but if that’s the way he wants it, because those were the types of musicians. They knew the charts and stuff, but a lot of the stuff they couldn’t feel. They felt Carnival Time pretty good. Sounds like they felt it pretty good, you know. 

George: My question for you now is, here we are, 2012. Mardi Gras 2012. We’re talking 52 years after Carnival Time was recorded. What are you doing this carnival time?

Al: Enjoying it. Appreciating it. Being thankful, and etc. I must say that carnival time is getting better and better every year. This is one of the better ones. I’ll always remember 2012, just like I remember 2011, and 2010, but it looks like they’re getting better and better. 

George: Well Al, it’s been a pleasure having you on GoNOLA radio. I want to say happy carnival time. 

Al: Same to you George, and GoNOLA radio. 

George: You’ve got it. 

Sunpie: Historian Ed Branley interviews Arthur Hardy, author of Arthur Hardy’s Mardi Gras Guide of the timeless history of Mardi Gras. 

Ed: We’re here with Mr. Arthur Hardy who is probably the foremost expert on Mardi Gras that we have in New Orleans. Good morning Arthur. 

Arthur: Good morning to you. Thanks for reading my resume exactly as we published. 

Ed: Well I’ve known your resume for way too long, as you know, so that’s a different story, right? We’re not kidding. We aren’t going there. What I wanted to talk about, because my beat here with GoNOLA.com is primarily history. What I wanted to ask you, or if I could get you to expound a little bit for folks, is things about carnival that you consider timeless. Some thing come and go over the years, but there’s just some things that are always there about Mardi Gras. I wondered if you could share some of the things that you consider to be timeless about our celebration. 

Arthur: I think at the very core of it is the spirit of it. The components are pretty much the same through the years, of private balls, public parades, but it’s really a spirit of people coming together to celebrate. It’s interesting to note that when things are at their worst, like after wars and after Katrina, if when Mardi Gras was at it’s perhaps most importance aspect in it’s old history, of boy do we need to celebrate now. We certainly saw that after Katrina when we didn’t even know if the city was going to come back. Mardi Gras helped bring it back. 

Ed: Do you remember all these people kept saying, I can’t believe you people are going to have Mardi Gras. All I could remember thinking is, why wouldn’t we. 

Arthur: Of course. We needed that. We chose to celebrate rather than surrender. I did a tremendous amount of national and international interviews Mardi Gras weekend. There were 1,500 credentialed press in town the first Mardi Gras after Katrina. Every person that I spoke to from the media thought we were crazy. How can you possibly justify this. The ones who stayed and did follow up interviews Ash Wednesday, every one of them got it. They said, now we get it. We see why you had no choice. You had to do this. It’s in your blood. It’s in your soul. It have us a rest, but from all the tragedies. It’s not that we were insensitive to it, but we just said hey, we’re down but baby we’re not out. 

Ed: I think it’s important since we’re having this conversation, so that people who are not from New Orleans can kind of get that spirit. We’re not talking about that drunken [dubach] that we see in the French quarter. When we say Mardi Gras and we say carnival, we’re talking about parades and family, and all of the other things that really don’t make the 30 seconds on CNN. 

Arthur: Exactly. It really is a remarkably wholesome and safe family oriented event. It’s a six mile picnic barbecue. It’s a time when families get together, and you may see people you see once a year on that same street corner every year, but your friends again and your family again. That was the beauty of the first carnival after Katrina was that we didn’t know who would be on that corner this year, and if they weren’t there did they simply choose not to come, maybe it was impossible for them to come, or maybe they were dead. It was a very poignant scene along parade routes after Katrina. I’m just so glad we chose to do it and show the world we still have that spirit. 

Ed: You bet. I’m thinking back to the people we see on Napoleon Avenue every year. You’re exactly right on that. Okay. Tell me, what’s the coolest throw this year that you can talk about yet, that you can’t, I know there’s probably some things that captains don’t want you dropping just yet, but come on you’ve got to tell me. Now what’s the coolest thing so far?

Arthur: I haven’t seen all of them yet, but of the one’s that I’ve seen I have to say Endymion has one. They’re returning to the Superdome this year. 

Ed: Right. 

Arthur: They haven’t been there in a couple years because of the construction going on there. They’re calling it a Dome coming. They have this giant plush Superdome with an Endymion figure on top of it. That is really the neatest and oddest [inaudible 19:43] that I’ve seen.

Ed: Too cool. I’m going to walk with the Crusader band my kids senior year, so I’m going to see if I can bag one of those for sure. Anything else really cool?

Arthur: Hermes has some nice plastic goblets. There’s a new crew of Nicks and I haven’t seen their throws, but anything at [First Year] parade throws is collectible. This is a 500 member female crew that’s going to parade a week before Ash Wednesday following the Druids [inaudible 20:10]. For people who collect things, as I do, whenever a crew debuts you want to get that first throw, hoping that there will be a second throw, but sometimes what if they only last one year. Not this crew, they’re a stayer. But those are collectibles. 

Ed: Yeah, 500 women. I heard about this crew, yeah. That’s the thing too is that since [Backus] and Endymion are still men only, I guess it’s kind of logical that the gals are finally saying hey, we put all this time into your parade. I want to do something too. 

Arthur: Well that’s for sure. Of course Orpheus since it’s inception back in 1993 has always allowed women. They’re the only Super crew to do so. Now, [Musis] has a long waiting list. That’ really a Super crew in it’s own right. that’s the beauty of Mardi Gras. There’s something for everyone. It’s the most diverse celebration in the world. 

Ed: Definitely. Definitely. I appreciate you talking to us for this podcast. Of course as everybody knows, it’s Arthur Hardy’s Mardi Gras Guide, which you know the math. It’s in what year now? Thirty something. 

Arthur: Thirty six. 

Ed: Thirty six. Yeah, I was going to say. 

Arthur: Thirty six annual. 

Ed: I don’t even want to do that math. That’s just scary, because I remember the first one. 

Arthur: How it all started. Yeah, I started it when I was eight years old. 

Ed: It’s in just about every convenient store, drug store. 

Arthur: It is. 

Ed: Of course it’s MardiGrasGuide.com on the net. 

Arthur: That’s it. We sell a magazine and a coffee table history book too. I enjoy doing this. I think I’ve got the best job in New Orleans. 

Ed: Yeah, I think you do too at times. I’ve got to say that. Like I said, I appreciate you getting with us today. Thank for the conversation. 

Arthur: Thank you.

Ed: Looking forward, we’ll hear this on GoNOLA.com.

Arthur: Great. Happy Mardi Gras. 

Ed: Happy Mardi Gras. 

Sunpie: Perhaps you have an idea of what a Mardi Gras Indian is. The tribe of feathered colorful dancers are a carnival season icon. Our walking cultural encyclopedia Mikko interviews Ausettua AmorAmenkum who will show you a side of the Mardi Gras Indians you’ve never heard before. 

Mikko: White cloud hunters. Yellow Pocahontas. Red, whites, and blues. The Chickasaws. Ninth war Navajo. The wild Apaches. The Golden Eagles. The wild [Chappaqua]. The Mandingo warrior spirit of the Fi Yi Yi. These exotic names could be from any sort of chapter in any adventure book that maybe a young man or woman would read throughout the 20th century. What they are, are living breathing tribes of Mardi Gras Indian revelers. That represents a tradition that is both misunderstood and highly revered here in New Orleans. 

I’m here today, hello everyone I’m Mikko, and I have a very good friend of mine. Her name is Ausettua AmorAmenkum. just to catch people up here, here in New Orleans we’ve got the parades and the parties, and the balls of Mardi Gras, but there was this other carnival going on that a lot of white folks weren’t aware of. Now of course they’re very much aware of it. There’s some, I guess you’d say, minor controversy on how the Indians started it. There was this Brother Tillman in the yellow Pocahontas in the 1890′s. They were written up in the newspapers of the time. 

Even earlier than that, some people feel that there was this Chief [Pecate] in the Creole wild west, which was recorded as marching in 1884, somewhere in there. That was the same year that Buffalo Bill’s Wild West show came to town. Some theorize that maybe these young New Orleans men who probably were related to the Indians themselves, saw these Indians and decided for some reason that they saw something inspirational in them, and dressed up like them, and made up their own sort of carnival celebration dressed up as these Indians. Is that the kind of story you’ve heard? The beginning of the Mardi Gras Indian?

Ausettua: Well you know, because I consider myself not just a participant but also a researcher of it myself. The man you’re speaking of is [Beeke] who is kin to [Asatuti Montana]. 

Mikko: Yes. 

Ausettua: That was his relative, great, great, grandfather in terms of masking in the tradition. It is true that coincidentally the Wild Wild West show did come during that time. However, there are records at the Cabildo in as early as the late 1700′s of an ordinance being passed to forbid Africans from masking and dressing in feathers parading in public. 

Mikko: Wow. 

Ausettua: So that tells you that, no this happened before the Wild Wild West show. 

Mikko: So like 1780′s, 1790′s.

Ausettua: Yes. 

Mikko: I want to get into the, and for lack of a better word, spiritual part of the experience. Just why a woman, because you are a woman right? Yes. 

Ausettua: Yes. All woman. 

Mikko: All woman. I was reading, 1908 there was a famous confrontation with the police. A lot of the black Indians were arrested, but on that rap sheet that day, in costume, leading a lot of the men were four or five women’s names. I was like, wow. Even in 1908 women were dressing up. The in the 30′s, I guess the daughter or the wife of the chief of one tribe, but they had a spy girl. They had a girl. One thing that I think you can give us an insight on is when you put that mask on, and when you put your [inaudible 25:57] on, you’re sewing. You say I’m going to go home and sew tonight. You’ll probably sew extra today after this conversation. What is the transformation that goes on inside of Ausettua’s soul and her head. Besides the fun and the connection with your community, what’s going on in your soul?

Ausettua: Well, I perform. I’m the director of an African dance company. Kumbuka African Drum and Dance Collective. We’ve been together for 30 years. I performed all over the world. Before I began to mask I just said, oh I’ll just sew it, put the costume on and it will be like a performance. That was what I thought. However, unlike anything else that I’ve done, first of all I didn’t spend and invest time in preparing my suit. We don’t even call them costumes. They’re called Indian suits. 

Mikko: Every year at carnival time you get a new suit.

Ausettua: Yeah, it’s a new suit. So I had never for the African dance, I didn’t spend that kind of time in preparing my costume. Then I didn’t have the community effort, the communal effort of people coming together. I can’t tell you the people that would help me sew. Yes they were friends and family members, and then there were people I didn’t even know. People would come in town, and I teach at Tulane University, so there are lost of students that want to just experience sewing for whatever reason, or whatever. To see the amount of energy that people put into getting you ready, it’s humbling because they don’t have to do this, but they’re committed to it. 

When you finally put that suit on, you have all the energy of the people who helped you, when you put this suit on. That’s the first level of preparation in terms of the spiritual side of it. Second of all, you’re not getting any sleep because in any preparation for a spiritual transformation, one of the key elements is, there are some times that if you get lack of sleep it can induce a state of spiritual ecstasy, for lack of a better word. 

Mikko: Well, queen Ausettua AmorAmenkum, thank you for your time. 

Ausettua: You’re quite welcome. 

Mikko: By the way, you are a professor at Tulane of African dance and hip-hop, you’re the director Kumbuka African Dance Company, and so many other things, I’m sorry I can’t get it all in there. Is there anything you want to talk about right now while we have the microphone?

Ausettua: Well, this is Kumbuka’s 30th year, and we’re just so grateful to the ancestors for being able to still be in existence to serve the community and the audience. 

Sunpie: GoNOLA radio is a production of New Orleans Tourism Marketing Corporation, in conjunction with FSC Interactive. Music by Cale Pellick. My name is Sunpie. Tune in next week by subscribing to GoNOLA radio on iTunes, or GoNOLA.com.

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